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 Does Anarchy actually work?

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Pandemic
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PostSubject: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:56 am

If so, please explain the following (And if anyone is anti-anarchy, add more!)
-Cars. Speeding
-Vandialism
-Wreckless Teens
-Murder
-Theft
-Anti-revolution Capitalists
-Judges
-Distribution of jobs
-What would happen to Unions?
-Foreign attackers

(Calinis Ideas)
controlling drug use (which causes a tremendous amount of harm)
-any disturbances
- privacy and security would be destroyed
- soaring crime rates because of lack of justice system


Last edited by Pandemic on Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:30 pm; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:26 pm

- controlling drug use (which causes a tremendous amount of harm)
-any disturbances
- privacy and security would be destroyed
- soaring crime rates because of lack of justice system

most anarchists would tell you that many of the above are a result of capitalism. and that people are generally good-hearted individuals and that crime only happens because of the "crappy" living conditions capitalism gives. ha, what a laugh.
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:01 am

Cars / Speeding -- Because anarchism is an environmental philosophy, car production would be cut down and public transportation would probably be used the most. Buses would be used. And irresponsible bus driver could have another job that he or she is good and safe at.

Vandialism -- As in art?

Wreckless Teens -- Excuse me?

Murder -- One must as oneself WHY people murder. In many cases, it is because of mental disorders, in which case the murderer could go into a rehabilitation center or someplace to get better or taken care of. Were this to be a murder to gain something from another, I do not know why it would occur. (For example, poverty causes crime. Stop poverty).

Theft -- Why steal something? Usually, you would steal something because of a lack of a better way to get it. There is much theft among poor societies, so economic justice would do away with theft. Don't continue to persecute the poor, do away with poverty.

Anti-revolution Capitalists -- During the revolution, ignore them. Were any to take up arms and start killing, defend yourself. After the revolution, 'morals' would generally change because of the society's culture molding into a more free form. Things such as freedom, liberty, democracy, etc would be looked upon much different than now. So if you are born into an anarchist era, you obtain these traits.

Judges -- Judges are, in many cases, completely biased and corrupt. Court systems could very well exist in an anarchist society as long as they were based off of a fair, democratic basis.

Distribution of jobs -- Because factories would be run democratically by the workers (instead of having exploitative CEOs), qualified people would be more than welcomed because the aim of the factory/"company(?)" is no longer to make more money, but provide goods to the community.

What would happen to Unions -- I suppose they would be the ones more than ready to democratically run the company. ha

Foreign attackers -- This is a very important topic among anarchists. Anarchists believe in very strong, united forms of equal, horizontal organization (instead of the oppressive, exploitative, hierarchical structures). There could still be people dedicated to defense of the earth but they simply would have no bosses.

Controlling drug use -- It depends what time of drug it is. Take crack, for example; it was created simple for money and power. Many dealers result in drug dealing because there is no other option for a job, but in an anarchist society they would have a job (because companies would not discriminate based off the fact that they have to pay a worker).

Any disturbances -- Such as noise complaints? Ha. I suppose serious disputes could be resolved in a democratic court system if the opposed people seriously couldn't work it out themselves.

privacy and security would be destroyed -- That's simply an invalid statement.. I thought I was answering things.

soaring crime rates because of lack of justice system -- Explained.





For those who want to learn more about anarchism (instead of a select list of issues?), I suggest you learn about the philosophy itself and then you would see how the issues would be dealt with. I suggest visiting Infoshop.

http://www.infoshop.org/faq/index.html





Oh, and about the title.. I highly doubt any on this site truly believe the corporate news' propaganda that anarchism=chaos. In the Spaniard anarchist societies, "wreckless teens" and stealing were not issues because the SOURCES of the issues were gone. No chaos whatsoever.
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Pandemic
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:30 am

Great post, very informational!
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sat Oct 04, 2008 7:58 am

Pandemic wrote:
Great post, very informational!

Thank you. :]
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Sun Oct 05, 2008 11:52 pm

Nice post...but seriusly Anarchism is dumb...

Sorry to say, but whitout police you simply can't belive that EVRYONE is behaving the right way.

You ALWAYS got atleast 1 person that disturbes the society.
I don't even know why people belive in it...srsly...


-Rape with getting away
-Stealing to the max
-Teens would go CRAZY, old people arnt save anymore.

You get the thing Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 1:00 am

CoolKidX wrote:
Nice post...but seriusly Anarchism is dumb...

Sorry to say, but whitout police you simply can't belive that EVRYONE is behaving the right way.

You ALWAYS got atleast 1 person that disturbes the society.
I don't even know why people belive in it...srsly...


-Rape with getting away
-Stealing to the max
-Teens would go CRAZY, old people arnt save anymore.

You get the thing Wink

OOOOH, you're mixing up anarchy with omniarchy. I don't understand why people would steal things if they were PROVIDED FOR FREE.
Most think of the notion of stealing as something that just happens.. It doesn't, it's the RESULT of poverty. I say, you remove the source.
Also, most think of the highly advanced political philosophy as "teens rebelling", yet it goes back into the 1800's. It was respected RIGHT up to the time when corporate media "news" stations became mainstream.

Have you ACTUALLY looked into anarchism, instead of simply judging from what you've heard? Obviously not, because if you did you wouldn't bring up "teens going crazy" (and their hunger for the elderly's blood!?) or rape. Rape would be taken care of in a democratically run court system. Have you ever looked up the philosophies of Kropotkin, Pierre-Joseph Proudhon (the father of FEDERALISM, which is what your country is based off), Emma Goldman (one of the most prominent women's rights activist), Bakunin, etc. NONE ADVOCATED CHAOS, ONLY FREEDOM AND EQUALITY.

And besides, anarchist reject all forms of illegitimate authority (much like the Founding Fathers did, which is why the government must exist only with the consent of the people). There are forms of legitimate authority.

Oh, and most of you just spit out things you've heard (about "CHAOS", "CRIME", etc) yet you do not look back to Anarchist Spain to see if there were such things. There wasn't.

I just get mad when people don't think, but act.

Anarchism is a philosophy that advocates free, equal, horizontal organization over the oppressive, exploitable, hierarchical structure where there is no liberty. As for me, I don't need a policeman beating the shit out of me to know that hurting a brother or sister is wrong.
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 2:27 am

U just think that KenCat, but anarchism will never happen..


Last edited by CoolKidX on Mon Oct 06, 2008 3:18 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 2:57 am

In a Anarchist society everything would not be free. Everyone would have everything. Everyone would still want everything. A political process does not diminish greed nor instinct.

I steal from my neighborhood market all the time, is it right? No, do i do it because i can't afford it? No. I've done it because of 1. Peer Pressure 2. I didn't feel like wasting money on it because i could just grab it and waste the time and effort of trading/buying it. Ill tell you, if the government didn't stop me from stealing i would be one huge pain in the ass.

Anarchy won't magically take away Peer Pressure nor the ability to have everything/ want everything.
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 4:51 am

Pandemic wrote:
In a Anarchist society everything would not be free. Everyone would have everything. Everyone would still want everything. A political process does not diminish greed nor instinct.

I steal from my neighborhood market all the time, is it right? No, do i do it because i can't afford it? No. I've done it because of 1. Peer Pressure 2. I didn't feel like wasting money on it because i could just grab it and waste the time and effort of trading/buying it. Ill tell you, if the government didn't stop me from stealing i would be one huge pain in the ass.

Anarchy won't magically take away Peer Pressure nor the ability to have everything/ want everything.



But uh, peer pressure to do what? Steal free things? LOL


"if the government didn't stop me from stealing i would be one huge pain in the ass."
1) You just told me that it didn't because you obviously do it (illegally).
2) Why would you be a pain in the ass? Stealing free things isn't bad. "Yo dude, you're only cool if you steal that free candy bar over there".
WTF. Horrible argument, especially because you don't apply it to yourself and your philosophy. lol



"Anarchy won't magically take away the want for everything"
Last time I checked, I wasn't that a mindlessly materialistic consumer.. But ooookay.
And again, you're not applying your arguments to your own philosophy.. According to you, everyone wants everything. For those who can't pay, they steal. WTF.






"In a Anarchist society everything would not be free. Everyone would have everything."
1) The two sentences have nothing to do with each other.
2) Why?
3) You STILL haven't read up on anarchism like you should have.. If you're going to debate about it, you should research it instead of spitting shit.
4) One of Kropotkin's models explains how everything, systematically, could be free.
5) Why does everyone on this DEBATE forum post random disagreements with absolutely NO backup?!


"Everyone would still want everything."
Again, maybe YOU due to the capitalistic environment we live in, but not me.





CoolKidX wrote:
U just think that KenCat, but anarchism will never happen..
LOL

I just LOVED the examples, evidence, reasons, etc.
I love it especially because it happened in Spain and it's really just another political philosophy..
Look into what your posting about, or just don't post. hahha
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:27 am

Give me a break here, im hungover..
First two arguments no idea what your saying (or what i said)

How would everything be free though? I really cannot see, at all, how someone could have anything with nothing but trade to achieve it. Explain?
Yes, i would still be greedy, and want things, as i stated about 5000 times on that anarchy grounds place (Sorry forgot name), capitalism does not make me greedy. its my instinct to want more and too better myself.

now im going to take a nap because my head is killing me
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PostSubject: Re: Does Anarchy actually work?   Mon Oct 06, 2008 5:43 am

Pandemic wrote:
Give me a break here, im hungover..
First two arguments no idea what your saying (or what i said)

How would everything be free though? I really cannot see, at all, how someone could have anything with nothing but trade to achieve it. Explain?
Yes, i would still be greedy, and want things, as i stated about 5000 times on that anarchy grounds place (Sorry forgot name), capitalism does not make me greedy. its my instinct to want more and too better myself.

now im going to take a nap because my head is killing me

You shouldn't attempt debating if your hungover.. And yes, consumerism is what drives capitalism -- it makes the economy grow, though keeps people too occupied with materialistic shopping.. That is why before such corporations existed, everyone was so politically aware. Workers strikes, revolutions, etc.

Greed is not a natural human aspect, helping each other is. This can be seen in cells helping each other out in the organism. The difference with us is that we are cells, made up of cells, who are helping each other out in society (an organism).

"its my instinct to want more and too better myself"
Says...!? I'm sure it's instinct to better our strengths and whatnot, but I think we have evolved a little more than to rely on instinct.

We are humans.
We are conscious that we think.
We can think, not only act.

So yes, if we were low life baboons then we may have a tribal leader.. But I'm fine being equal and free.
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